00:02 [Music]
00:14 hey everybody welcome back to another episode of the Auto Accident Attorneys Podcast i'm your host Attorney Ali the
00:21 podcast as always is sponsored by the Auto Accident Attorneys Group we take
00:26 care of you on today's episode I'm so excited to have colleagues and personal
00:32 friends of mine i've got who I like to lovingly refer to as Professor Arouse
00:38 i've got Alvaro Arouse of the 3A law firm law management law management
00:45 company welcome Alvo thank you for having me i've got Miss Manell like
00:51 Chanel Caruso of Shahimi Law criminal
00:57 defense attorney fantastic attorney even better friend manell thank you so much for coming today so nice thanks for
01:03 having me happy to be here i love seeing your beautiful faces and you guys are very close so I'm so happy that you are
01:10 both on the same episode but I feel like the conversation is going to naturally flow and Alvo can essentially take over
01:17 probably take over my job right yeah she's like a little sister
01:23 right uh you might be like a step brother she's more like little sister i
01:29 have a bigger place in your heart but I think Ally still has a good place in your heart too i love that thank you
01:35 let's start to just sort of fall into this i know that you're coming off of uh
01:42 an evening with fellow attorneys and colleagues from Johnny's Hideway slowly ease into this and you tell us about
01:49 yourself yeah don't talk too fast my synapses aren't firing quite quick
01:55 enough um uh I always say I'm just a long-haired hippie from San Francisco
02:01 and uh dropped out of med school to be a writer and ended up uh working with
02:09 lawyers which I never thought and just created this company it's in 47 states
02:16 and 18 countries and it's just and it's 100% referral so it's just crazy that I
02:23 So I'm like I just made this up and but by the time I'm done talking you'll understand i love that I love that about
02:31 you yeah so you are also a natural connector yeah so I didn't realize
02:40 um the power and the value of having a a
02:45 diverse network right um not only because you might need that person or
02:53 somebody that they know right um or anybody out there might need them right
02:59 um but I realized the general counsel for GE like the appliances out of um
03:08 Michigan was going to go out on her own and was referred to me by a DC client
03:13 and she was uh she did employment and she said "Uh why should I hire you?" And
03:22 I go "Well I do this." And she's like "I'm number one in the world in that." I'm like "Well I do you know I can help
03:27 with this a second you know all marketing things and then by the time I get to like number six I'm like "Well I
03:33 know people." She goes "That's exactly why I'm hiring you i want you to connect
03:39 me." And so that opened up a whole like the lawyer's dinner club you know it's
03:45 just it's one of these things where I bring the right personalities who can help one another but then also help
03:52 their clients right so it's been fun and I think that's such an important skill set outside of we're talking we're
03:59 sitting with attorneys and you're in the legal industry but it's such an important thing just in life in general
04:05 yeah totally i mean I said like I joke everyone assumes I'm an attorney but I
04:10 joke I'm like I just play one on TV i mean but I'm a normal person you know
04:16 and I think you can apply this in any aspect of your life you know you don't
04:22 have to be a lawyer i'm not a lawyer you know you can be just be you but know how
04:28 to connect the dots and the people i'm Persian we'll get into that background and compare and contrast with Manell uh
04:35 Persian parents are pretty strict and especially on my younger sister so she
04:41 was the girl growing up and my mom used to always tell her like you know stop going out so much stay home i don't want
04:47 you to go out and I remember I'm 10 years older than Holly and I remember telling my mom I'm like "Hey that's the worst advice." I was in I had just
04:54 graduated college i was like "That's the worst advice don't tell her to stop going out she should go out what she
04:60 should stop doing is going out with the same group of people every single day." Yeah go expand your network correct and
05:07 that's what people do they're like I want to you know meet new people but they end up crowding with the same group
05:14 just like you said oh no it's just don't be afraid to get out there and be yourself and I think one thing that you
05:20 are really good at Alvo is it's you know it's not just about the quantity of the connections it's also the quality and I
05:28 think that's just obviously especially in a business standpoint is just as important because yeah you can connect me with everybody anybody that I might
05:37 need but it's it's quality referral which you did but it's also the quality
05:42 referral and that's that's what's important too and um I think you
05:47 professionally and personally achieved that thank you great job Ala i hope that
05:53 made you feel better it Yeah yeah i mean I mean No it just I got to the point
05:60 where I used to care what other people think you know um and talk about your
06:06 parents so my parents were in medicine right so that's how I was going to but
06:11 I've left and super strict my brother and sister are professional athletes i'm
06:17 not clearly I'm built like a 13-year-old boy but I'm deceptively athletic um and so I went to this all
06:26 boy super high-end school got shipped to Paris to go to Serbone but I was a club
06:32 kid in Tampa so I hated Paris so I came back um and I was an academic scholar so
06:40 I had a scholarship so I signed up for all these classes uh calc physics
06:47 philosophy and the counselor's like don't do this don't do this and I was like shut up I went to judge fine so you
06:54 can't take that case load and go clubbing six nights a week so I lost my
06:60 I got a 0.7 nice as yeah
07:05 0.7 right I lost my scholarship um I uh got up put on probation and my parents
07:13 ship me to Brazil to go to med school oh my gosh but that's what has given us what Alvaro
07:20 is today I want to come back to Brazil but before we get too far down that road I want to
07:26 provide Minnell an opportunity to introduce herself and and let's hear awesome a you're sweet okay so So I'm
07:32 Minnell Caruso i'm a criminal defense attorney um I have my own firm Shahimi
07:38 Law i started it in 2017 i've been practicing since 2012 i was managing
07:44 partner at a firm uh for a few years before I went off on my own and um I
07:51 love it i do i genuinely do professionally that's I can't imagine
07:56 doing anything else than being a criminal defense lawyer and having my own firm um I don't think I would love
08:02 it as much if I wasn't on my own um personally I'm a mom i have two
08:09 beautiful boys who are just my world and uh they they drive me crazy and I love
08:16 them so much uh yeah so you're a boy mom i'm a girl dad so we have the dynamics
08:25 do you think you were always supposed to be a girl dad because like I know for sure I was supposed to be a boy mom
08:30 i It's so funny that you asked that because I I never thought about being married ever since I was a kid i I never
08:38 imagined a wedding or having a wife but I always imagined being a dad
08:43 as a boy I always imagined being a dad to boys and when my first daughter was
08:50 when during the ultrasound for the first pregnancy when it turned out that it was female I went through a minor depressive
08:56 episode and that's when the first graze showed up now I look at it and I think that I was
09:03 meant to be a girl dad because it opened up things about myself that I didn't
09:08 know existed had I been a boy dad I would have I would have loved my life i
09:14 would have been moving forward but I wouldn't know the things that I know now cuz I would have been more sensitive and aware absolutely 100% yeah there's a
09:21 saying and I'm going to totally butcher it but I think I'll get the gist of it where it's like
09:27 um God gives you firstborn as as a boy gives you a boy as your firstborn or a boy as your child to
09:35 teach you the love that you never had oh wow and there's some other one for girl
09:41 dads which I'm sorry I didn't really pay attention to but I'll find it and I'll share it with I I think the moment you
09:48 have a kid right and people just don't understand like you just you can't
09:54 explain it in a way like oh I have a dog and it's like you have no idea that the
09:59 minute you have that first child or any child um you completely lost your ego
10:05 because before that moment everything was decided in your life based on what you want sure once you have a kid out
10:12 the window yeah you've like the concept of time like all those things so I we
10:17 have three kids we have uh boy and I thought we were done and she's
10:23 like let's let's go for three i go why do you want three boys she goes cuz it might be a girl yeah right and and she's
10:32 like I don't care either way if it's a boy it's a boy so it ended up being a girl right so we've got two boys and a
10:38 girl which is our same dynamic you know I have an older brother and a younger sister and I had met her like in between
10:46 meetings for the ultrasound and by the time I got home there were two tables of just
10:52 mounds of pink everywhere right but I mean siblings they're the longest
10:59 relationship you'll ever have in your life right true and they'll always be with you and to see them develop like I
11:07 can see my influence and Elizabeth's influence but they have their own little
11:13 personalities in my soul and and to see that you know as they grow up it's just
11:19 they're the funnest toys yeah they are they're Gosh it changes your world for sure it's my favorite thing to do and I
11:24 was very similar to you Ally i never I never marriage was never on my radar i
11:31 mean I was and being a Middle Eastern girl like it's different but I never
11:36 even cared for I always wanted to be a mom and in fact I was on that journey
11:41 and then co shut me down and then I met my husband which again is a whole other
11:46 podcast episode everything that transpired with my husband who um very suddenly passed away um on my birthday
11:54 on on Alvo's birthday he reminds me of that every year you know it's my he hates it i hate for you Albert i know
12:01 i'm sorry for you Albert that came out i know it came out perfect
12:06 it came out perfect for our relationship but yeah so um it's just I know for sure
12:14 though that I was supposed to be a boy mom because I I don't have that it's I have
12:21 three brothers and I was raised like a boy like my dad made that's what makes her I think that's why we connected cuz
12:28 she's not a normal you know but man she's normal she's not a normal girl i
12:36 mean like tell so this is how Alvar and I met we uh I graduated in 2012 and sat
12:44 for the bar and then you know you're sitting there for three months like what do I do with my life until the bar results come out and I was like well I
12:52 need money i need to start working and I started interviewing and Alvaro I had no
12:58 idea i thought he was a lawyer um I replied I think it was like a Craigslist ad or something and it was at an it was
13:04 at a law firm it was a criminal defense firm is it Craig Jacobs yes estate no it
13:09 was King King and Kings uh Jacob's King jacob so Scott did criminal estate yes
13:16 and so I went and I interviewed and Alvaro was conducting the interview and he kind of introduced himself kind of
13:23 not and we after what it was like 20 minutes in he goes I really like you i
13:29 really like you a lot but I don't like you for this job i'm not going to offer you this job i was like okay and then he
13:35 was like but let me tell you what I do and then he told me what he did and that he's a law firm consultant and he helps
13:41 lawyers basically build and grow their firms and connects people and yeah so and that's
13:48 what happened he connected me with Don Turner who whose reputation preceded him
13:55 may he rest in peace he passed away also in 2023 but um so he connected me with
13:60 Don and then literally a week later I was having lunch with him and Don and then Don offered me a job and I started
14:06 working for Dawn before I passed the bar and became partner and I became partner within two years of that of and I
14:13 basically took over the firm from day one um the day I got my bar results you know it was a Friday monday morning
14:19 Judge Berford in Cobb County Superior Court was swearing me in in his chambers at like 7:30 in the morning he swore me
14:26 in and then he literally goes "All right counselor you have a case on my calendar come on." I was like "Wait don't I have
14:32 to like get a number?" And he's like "No it's my courtroom." So Judge Bford took me into his court into a courtroom and
14:39 it was this massive calendar call and we did have a case on calendar and Don goes "All right I'll see you back at the
14:44 office." And literally dipped out and that's like I love Biver he's got um I
14:50 was like "Is this even allowed?" Like so I did I he called the case and it was a
14:55 case that had already been negotiated for a null pros which is a dismissal and so I I stood up and I said "I'm here on
15:02 that case." And I believe the state has a motion and the prosecutor said "Yeah
15:08 judge we're we're going to null pro blah blah blah." And Judge Bifford goes "Now Miss Shahimi tell the court how
15:16 long you've been practicing." And I literally looked at my watch i go "Oh like 45 minutes." And he goes "4 minutes
15:24 and you've got your first dismissal i think you're off to a good start." And I was so sweet and so memorable and I'll
15:29 cherish that memory forever and and the way he handled it cuz clearly Yeah like clearly I should not legally have been
15:36 practicing law because I think I needed to be like filed but it's his courtroom and that's why he's like it's my court
15:43 that's beautiful that's a great anecdote yeah since you you said null pros and
15:48 most of our listeners are uh consumers and my mother my mom hates every time I
15:55 mention her because she thinks I'm making fun of her but I Oh mom and June i love you mom thank you for listening i
16:01 love you too we love you too M um so they're consumers so null pros
16:07 Latin yeah for we will not prosecute or we will not Yeah and so it's basically a
16:13 fancy way to say your case is dismissed and so if somebody is facing criminal
16:18 charges u when they get that that's a that's a win you get that and you run as fast as you
16:25 can out of the courtroom without committing any more crimes but no um a null process obviously magic it's it's
16:31 the equivalence to a not-uilty verdict without having to go through the not guilty process ideally one of the things
16:39 I like about her is her self-confidence you know and I think for Bifford to have
16:46 done that and to have gotten that dismissal just like cemented
16:54 you know because she was just naturally self-confident like that's one of the things I liked about her i still like
16:59 about um it's the fact that she went out on a like her first swing was a home run
17:08 like then it's like "All right let's go." Starting so it was poetic it was really cool and um yeah I mean because
17:15 So that was 12 2012 that was October 31st it was Halloween wow yeah cuz bar
17:22 results came out that Friday so it was like that following Monday or something so almost 13 years huh
17:28 spooky dismissal a spooky dismissal but yeah so in practical terms on a null
17:34 pros if somebody is looking for a job and
17:39 they have to fill out uh an employment application what are the ramifications
17:44 of a null pros what what do you have to report and what do you not sure so it depends on how the question is asked
17:50 right so if someone's like if the question is have you ever been arrested well I mean yes even if your case is
17:58 ultimately dismissed the process or dismissed via other another operation of
18:03 law you were arrested and you were fingerprinted and that's always going to be there for law enforcement purposes
18:10 it's never fully expuned or restricted so my thing is always be
18:17 truthful that's going to be my advice in those situations because ultimately you can further explain generally with job
18:24 applications they give you that opportunity of saying hey if the answer to this is yes please further explain
18:31 here and at that point you can then answer and say now there's other operations of law can I go ahead couple
18:38 questions because I tell my kids this it pays to be precise with your question
18:45 um if you do answer yes like um is it
18:51 best to keep it very short yeah it depending and on the employer and the question what you think they're going to
18:57 want to see now if it's a sales job and it's your first time out of college and
19:03 it's like a competitive field and you're dealing with like a recruiter or someone in HR I think it's better to be a little
19:10 bit more forthcoming and say "Hey this was a bogus issue something crazy and
19:16 ultimately it was dismissed because it should have been but yeah unfortunately I was arrested and did get us to this
19:22 point but this has nothing to do with my life now or even then and this is the person I am um if it's something else I
19:29 mean and it might not even come up a lot of times if it is restricted now the law changed I want to say in 2015 the law
19:36 changed with um record restriction that allows things to be just automatically
19:42 done in the court system and so if it doesn't come up it doesn't come up and
19:48 just real quick while it's on my mind an arrest is not a conviction right correct
19:53 so if the question is have you ever been convicted of a crime and you haven't then you can truthfully say no right but
20:00 once a mug shot's out there yeah i mean it's But so that's a null process right
20:06 i've had qui no pro qua quai null pro r
20:11 o that's why we shortened it because we don't know how to say it eq UI so we just say null pros she don't deal with
20:17 the last rest of the letters so I've had a couple friends ask me "Hey I need a
20:24 lawyer because I have this record or I have
20:29 this mole." So you've got this on here when would you want It's called an
20:35 expungement yeah it is an expungement but really what it's referred to now is a record restriction i'm not a lawyer i
20:42 just spray one on TV you're a consumer today so basically depending on
20:49 the operation of the element that got us to that result your record will either
20:55 be automatically restricted or you have to go through certain steps to get it restricted who should get an expungement
21:02 well it depends isn't that the best lawyer answer ever it depends because the only lawyer answer i'm going to give
21:09 you um an example okay so let's say your case is just flatout dismissed because
21:16 it truly was bogus and that you had nothing to do like you never should have been arrested like it was wild but you
21:22 still have a mug shot right you can go through channels to get that restricted removed off your record but again if I'm
21:28 interviewing for like a big company and I really want that job I'm not going me
21:33 personally I'm not going to sit there and like gamble and be like I'm just not going to tell them about this cuz it was [ __ ] you know yeah i'm going to be
21:40 forthcoming and say that that's me and be like listen I was arrested it was dismissed it's it was technically
21:46 restricted but there's always ways that it can potentially be found so that's
21:51 one scenario another scenario is in the instance of like um a pre-trial diversion program so for example uh we
21:59 see this a lot in cases of like theft by shoplifting or misdemeanor marijuana
22:06 um sometimes felony or um like family violence battery cases for example in
22:12 Fulton County where I practice a lot a firsttime offender Fulton County um simple battery family violence husband
22:19 and wife get into a dispute some hands are laid on each other it's like a one-time incident i mean it happens okay
22:25 it's not right but it happens husband or wife get arrested a lot of times um depending on
22:32 the allegations and their record in exchange for them completing a 24-week
22:38 family violence intervention program and some community service and paying like a fee the the solicitor's office will
22:45 offer them a diversion program and it's a great avenue for first-time offenders it's a great resolution for these types
22:51 of cases and it's not a guarantee you're not guaranteed to get it um but a lot of
22:56 times that's a win for for us and so it's like okay let's do this let's complete it and the the end result is a
23:04 dismissal a null pros and the record restriction so the client can truthfully
23:09 say I was never convicted of this you don't plead to anything you're not So it's it's a it's a safe it's a safety
23:14 net it's a fail safe for them so that is supposed to be an immediate record restriction once the dismissal the null
23:21 process entered into by the clerk's office that's transmitted to the GBI which is the Georgia Bureau of
23:27 Information and that is supposed to be what restricts it from your record again
23:32 law enforcement and certain security checks and certain clearances will always see that they's no way to
23:41 officially effectively one million% remove it it ends if you're connected though well I guess yeah do you know
23:47 Donald because I could use a connect to Donald um I uh I have this story about
23:54 that one time I never actually got arrested yeah so I was going to I listen
24:01 to music and I need alone time sometimes because I'm around a lot of people and I'm driving and the office is right
24:08 outside of South Carolina so it's like a two-hour drive i'm like I'll do it right so and this was years ago um and so I
24:18 had weed in my car but I put it in my glove box um and I'm like well after
24:26 this meeting after I'm done working I'll smoke a bowl right so I'm driving down
24:31 this highway it's a two-lane highway bunch of like um semitrs is it two lanes
24:38 one way each way maybe yeah um and I'm just I'm I'm almost there it's like 7:30
24:45 in the morning and through this and I'm going like 65 and through this blind
24:52 like turn these two teenagers blow through the stop sign and so and I'm
24:58 going like 65 so I couldn't even say oh [ __ ] it was just like what and then bam
25:05 right full speed spun around they hit you or you hit them i hit them because they blew through them i t-boned broke
25:12 the kid's leg one guy's arm right spun around spun around like Right and so
25:20 knowing lawyers I was like "Right." Um and I kept looking for my car keys so
25:27 that I could unlock the glove box right and get rid of the And it was like Yeah
25:33 it was just like a nug it's not like I was rolling with pounds like I wasn't back you weren't trafficking yeah
25:38 correct right and uh personal use is what we would say in a legal defense
25:45 that's a just personal use yeah so I get in the ambulance i can never find it
25:51 right so I get in and I've never been in a car wreck i've never been like touched by cop like so I was just like get in
25:58 the ambulance i get the ambulance like I have four herniated discs and stuff so the cop comes in super cool also from
26:05 California right and he's telling me telling me you know kind of what
26:10 happened and everything i'm like "Hi the kids." And he starts to walk out and he comes back in he goes "Oh one more
26:15 question." Oh no what was in that Tupperware box in
26:21 your glove box i'm like "What are you talking about?" He's like "Well when we tow cars we have to make inventory of
26:27 what was in the car right what was that?" I'm like "I don't know." And he
26:33 goes "Dude it's totally cool i do it too it's It's just not technically legal
26:40 right now." He goes "I know dude i'm from California i know but it's not technically." And I was like "It's not
26:47 mine." He's like "Well who uses your car?" I go "I valet all the time i have no idea." Right and I woke up early and
26:53 I just left right so he's just like slow baiting me and I'm so hurt and like I'm
26:58 like "Dude it's mine." He's like "All right i'm going to have to arrest you oh my
27:04 gosh right and I'm in like 2 hours away i have no car i'm in the hospital i hope the listeners paid attention to that
27:10 line of questioning dude it's okay it's okay he totally baited me he totally
27:15 baited me cops are not your friends when they're investigating a crime they are in general but not when they're
27:22 investigating a crime he He just left like he was there for 20 minutes he leaves he could Oh one more just Just a
27:29 little bit just tiny little bit like And I here I am like where's San Francisco to like you know what part of San
27:35 Francisco oh you're from California too i want to be your friend oh yeah so uh
27:41 he goes but listen man I understand what's happening it was on a Thursday he's
27:46 like just come back Monday um I'm not going to do anything
27:52 right now come back Monday it'll be like a 4hour process we'll book you in we'll fingerprint you like he explains what's
27:59 going to happen he's just but just remember you go get like okay fine right
28:04 so I get out of the hospital who do I call immediately my clients right I knew
28:11 she was busy so I busy I called I think you're in labor probably
28:18 probably you weren't even licensed that's why um so I call who I need to
28:24 call right in terms of being connected it's a very important do you want to say who you called or Mike Hawkins of course
28:30 I would call Mike Cawkins mike who I would call okay mike Hawkins represented Coach Bud when he got his DUI dismissed
28:38 that being said he still got a mug shot coach Bud right but Coach Bud who was
28:45 coaching for Atlanta used to work for the San Antonio Spurs okay and Mike
28:53 Hawkins was the dean of the National College of DUI defense like this guy knows deal like he is Jamal Anderson
29:01 like you name so Bud calls the team lawyer for the Spurs who went to school
29:08 with Mike Hawkins and so Hawkins gets Bud gets it like dismissed right but one
29:16 of his cases was a vehicular homicide um a Georgia State Patrol not Coach Bud's
29:21 case this is a different This is a different but that Mike handled right okay so
29:26 um there was a baseball coach for the Braves um who wife was killed by a Georgia
29:34 State Patrolman who blew through a right in a chase or whatever and Mike Hopkins
29:41 did the vehicular homicide case for Georgia State Patrol so I called Mike i go "Mike I'm in trouble." Right he
29:49 calls the head of Georgia State Patrol who's his friend and he goes "Hey I need
29:56 a favor can can you talk to So the head of Georgia State calls the trooper and
30:03 tells him the story?" And he's like "I'm cool with it if the prosecutor's cool with it of course Mike knows
30:10 prosecutor." Prosecutor's like "Totally fine not a problem got it." Like so the
30:16 one time I never got arrested is because of who you connection networking it's
30:22 important and I make mistakes like and trust me guess who doesn't travel anymore during I don't travel like a
30:29 first god dank I'm glad I'm alive those kids are alive yeah like I'm glad you
30:34 know um it worked out the way it I mean but it teaches you stuff but it's also
30:41 important not to just stay in your little hole on your phone video game get out there network be a good person you
30:48 drove and learning lessons along the way too i I know you had a driver bring you here today
30:55 about you know around the same time doing what I do my clients have a lot of
31:01 events so I'm I might have on top of a a
31:06 full day three events in one night and I've got to do my round it's like speed
31:11 dating hey how's it going yeah everything good right let's grab lunch blah blah blah yeah right but I could do
31:17 that and then a lot of times people come with me and like "Hey we're going to Johnny's who wants to go?" Right and
31:24 knowing lawyers there's usually alcohol i kind of like it myself
31:30 and I just know not to make mistakes right like I'm not losing I'm not
31:36 getting in an accident i'm not killing anybody i'm not like leaving my kids like I'm not doing that so I would just
31:43 re So I've had Irvin for since my first at least 12 13 years like he come he
31:51 Thanksgiving Halloween like he takes me everywhere you know and so last night I
31:58 was out all day in meetings I left my car in Buckhead because I knew I had all
32:03 these events last night and yeah so he picked me up this morning brought me
32:09 here is waiting for me outside i love it even Irvin even the driver that's part of your network yeah swervven Irvin
32:15 that's what we call i love that name as a recap of of the pragmatic advice if
32:22 the application question is about an arrest that is you're always truthful but if
32:29 it's an arrest whether you're convicted or not you're still arrested right if it's a if they're asking if you've been
32:36 convicted that's Yeah and then if you haven't been convicted then you say "No I have not been convicted." And there's
32:41 different ways to avoid a conviction even after arrest oj Simpson said "Right I didn't do it." Um but no so like you
32:48 know the pre-trial diversion scenario with the family violence case is one then there's also um Georgia's First
32:56 Offender Act which is another way to avoid a conviction and that would be um a similar situation
33:03 where you would with that case though in that situation if you plead under the Georgia offenders act you would say I'm
33:12 pleading guilty and a sentence would be imposed but what happens is the judge doesn't
33:18 sign that sentence and he holds it literally they hold your sentence and
33:24 for the probated amount of time whether it's one year five years whatever and then if you successfully complete the
33:31 terms of that probated sentence um that sentence is ripped up and shredded and a
33:38 discharge and a quiddle is submitted to the GBI again to show to restrict your
33:43 record to show that you were not convicted so in certain cases like drug
33:49 possession or even um you know assaults or felony serious felonies um if you are
33:56 eligible for the Georgia first offender I mean it's a great alternative to
34:01 potentially ruining someone's life for a one-time mistake or um you know thing
34:08 that is not of their nature most of my clients are normal people i mean they're run-of-the-mill people who made a bad
34:14 decision one time or you know had a bad day you know it's not like their career
34:19 or hang out or hanging out with the wrong people wrong time it might not be the wrong person right like so um one
34:27 thing I've learned is and this is from my family lawyers and my criminal
34:32 lawyers is let's say you're going through a divorce obviously you guys are yelling
34:38 and fighting and liking each other right when emotions are high right people turn
34:45 into different like a next level right and one phone call i'm so mad at you i'm
34:52 so mad at you one phone call to 911 right right here comes domestic violence
34:58 here terroristic threats terrorists assault all this stuff right spirals out
35:03 of control it spirals and it could be on even a [ __ ] phone call right yeah so
35:10 also knowing how easy it is and then the consequences of what might cuz even a
35:16 mug again once you have a mug shot you have a mug shot right so if you're going through a divorce or if you're with I
35:23 mean somebody who at that moment in time sure is going to agitate you and lose
35:29 control or they're going to lose control or you're remove yourself from the situation cuz they can get you in
35:36 trouble for the rest of your life the best legal advice I'd give people especially this pertains mostly I think
35:41 for DUIs and this is for all consumers everybody if you're committing a crime
35:46 you cannot commit more than one crime at the same time right explain that yeah for example let's talk about DUIs it's
35:53 not illegal to drink and drive it's illegal to drink and drive with your BAC
35:59 being above a 008 if you're over 21 okay oh it man if you're going to drink and
36:06 drive even if it's one beer or 10 beers first of all don't that's my number one piece of advice don't do it if we're
36:13 already there and you're doing it you cannot commit another crime while in the
36:19 process of committing a current crime of drinking and driving that means your seat belt is on your turn signals are
36:25 being used you're making complete stops at every stop sign your tags you're maintaining your lane your tags are in
36:32 order your brake lights are in order correct so that's what I'm saying like you won't know like if your headlight is
36:38 out or a tail like what are some of the top re like tags expired pull you
36:44 they're looking the handsree being just holding your phone your phone I've had more of those DUI related cases in the
36:51 last two years than I've had in my whole career as being the reasonable articulable suspicion for the stop is
36:57 that oh they were on their phone or they're holding their phone because they're looking on GPS or something right I mean that's had I've had more of
37:04 those cases I've been meaning to change my brake light they're not pulling them over because they suspect them of drunk
37:10 driving they're pulling them over for something completely different and then they typically ask "Right have you had any?" Well and it depends they use that
37:17 they use that as a tool like I'm going to tell you I'm be honest with you if it's like 12:00 in the afternoon you're driving down Alpharetta and there's a
37:24 cop and he sees you on your phone he may not likely pull you over or a broken tail light but if it's at 2 a.m 2 a.m or
37:31 midnight or and you know and you're you're on your phone for a split second to put it up on your hands-free device
37:37 you're not even supposed to do that while you're operating the vehicle that's that's enough reasonable article
37:43 suspicion to pull you over because he's like "Oh well maybe she's she's it's late she was drinking." And then that
37:49 goes into the DUI investigation another piece of dad advice don't be out on the road at unreasonable hours yeah that's
37:56 what my parents say nothing good happens nothing good happens after midnight well
38:03 the advice is if if you're I mean I'm I'm older now i don't want to be out after midnight but for my kids when they
38:09 listen if it's going to be after midnight don't definitely don't go in anyone else's car get the Uber out a
38:16 driver absolutely it's not worth it the 20 bucks the 30 bucks even a hundred
38:22 bucks even 100 listen the DUI is going to a first lifetime DUI on average i
38:27 mean minimum of five grand a minimum crazy and that's like for a cheap lawyer and who's still a good lawyer but
38:33 they're just their fees are less i mean after you add in all the mandatory conditions you're going to have to do the bail the time the classes the
38:41 classes themselves and then the lawyer's fees and then the fines even if they get rid of the DUI most jurisdictions in the
38:48 state of Georgia you get punished for a DUI so a beautiful paying $10,000 for an
38:54 $80 Uber ride a beautiful resolution in DUIs is reckless driving which is a
38:59 traffic offense and it falls off your record it goes away there's no license suspension it's four points on your record unless you're able to plead n but
39:07 you get punished in the same way you would if you had just pled guilty to the DUI in terms of the community service
39:13 hours the alcohol and drug evaluation the risk reduction class the MAD victim impact panel the probation and the fines
39:19 and the fees again I'm not a lawyer like I'm just a normal per like a literally a
39:25 normal p i mean you guys are too right but well I'm a superhero i'm just saying
39:31 that also it still baffles me that I do what I do right like that people come to
39:37 me for advice like lawyers come to me for advice and how much I charge I think is
39:42 a like it's crazy i know you're cheap you're affordable yeah right but it's
39:49 valuable they they come to me with questions and lawyers are lawyers i have to be right right but I'm a normal
39:56 person i always say the lawyers have taught me so much about what to do like
40:03 what to avoid how to be smart things I don't even think about like change your
40:09 bra you know like little tiny tiny things make sure your lights are on like that's
40:15 another thing i have automatic that's how coach Bud got i have automatic lights my kids as you know they love to
40:21 sit in the cars and just mess with and press buttons and I let them because it buys me 10 minutes of like quiet time
40:28 but I can't tell you the number of times my kids have turned my automatic lights off and I do not realize it yeah
40:33 immediately and then it's like whoa wow those you know but again 12:00 in the
40:39 afternoon cops aren't going to Right you know that's not a big deal i mean but
40:44 you bet your butt right when the sun starts setting it becomes a big deal a sad and and along the lines of aside
40:50 from the time another sad truth of the universe is also the type of vehicle you
40:57 know yeah if you've got a brand new S500 you're less likely depends where you are
41:04 right you know like if you're in an area like Milton Alpharetta where everyone's
41:09 driving nice luxurious vehicles that's just who we have to pull that's who the cops have to deal with but yeah I still
41:15 Ryan Williams no no the name doesn't sound familiar is he an attorney he's an attorney i might know him oh I do know I
41:22 saw him he's African American okay okay he's been pulled over and he and he's
41:29 he's a lawyer he's smart but he's real he's been pulled over I think like 15
41:34 times in all different types of vehicles because he has you know he's has a
41:40 successful practice he and and so it might be this kind of car they're normal
41:45 cars or nothing it's not like a Bugatti it's Oh we forgot a Ferrari or anything like they're normal cars
41:52 but for 15 times like he just posted last week yeah he had four cops descend
41:58 on him for like no for no reason right like like your tint which was legal like
42:06 he's never done anything but he keeps getting pulled over by cops
42:15 right and it's just it sucks but I'm glad that he posts about it because it's
42:21 a real thing like you think you're just doing nothing but chances are like
42:30 there was an attorney who used to do a lot of um DUIs and he used to joke around he's retired now but he used to
42:36 tell me that you know he his office was in Atlanta in Buckhead and he would wake up at like 4 in the morning sometimes
42:43 and not be able to sleep so he's like I'm just going to go ahead head to the office and this is when the Nighthawks were prevalent in Atlanta which is the
42:49 Georgia State Patrol like DUI Division that they do the the night scene they still do that but they there's still
42:55 nighthawks out there it's not as big I don't think anyways so he said he would used to drive and just like coast a
43:02 little bit out of the lane just to purpose just just on purpose just to see if you get pulled over because he was
43:07 clearly sober but like you got to go and mess with GSP right now don't do that
43:13 you know speaking about being pulled over as an inevitability another thing so Minnell I don't know if I've ever
43:20 told you this but I started out in criminal defense yeah I thought you did that a little bit it was out in
43:26 California yeah and um which is a whole different like world out there i feel it
43:31 is just the system yeah that's why we get along
43:38 one thing that dawned on me after doing a handful of cases before I switched over to personal injury was that I had
43:46 never met anyone that ever had ever talked themselves out of a charge or an
43:54 arrest in front of a cop in other words people think that they can explain their way out of something because they don't
44:00 want to get arrested they think they feel they might be able to avoid the rest right so I've gotten to the point where I tell my own family members I'm
44:07 like "Shut your mouth." Yes more truthfully actually say "Shut the [ __ ] up." Yeah please and they're like "Well
44:15 they'll they'll arrest me." Like that's fine i don't know how we got like down this rabbit hole of get cops and getting
44:22 arrested and stuff but one of the questions I get a lot which let's say we make a mistake one night yeah
44:29 and you get pulled over and you just said "Shut the [ __ ] up." Yeah right
44:35 everyone's like "What do I say to a person?" I'll tell you I know this i this I have this conversation i have
44:41 this conversation all the time because I get people all the time asking so I do a lot of DUIs duis are like my main focus
44:47 i pivoted my um criminal defense practice i'm not doing major felonies anymore so I do a lot of DUIs i've
44:54 taught DUI seminars anyways if you are being pulled over and
45:01 the cop is asking you to step out of the vehicle there is a very very very very
45:07 good chance you're going to jail regardless so if I were pulled over and
45:13 the cop was asking me to step out of the vehicle and I had not had any alcohol or
45:18 I was not under the influence of any alcohol at all let's just say you are though okay well I'm going to give you both smears cuz honestly my answer is
45:24 the same okay i will not step out of the vehicle unless I'm you're arresting me
45:30 so I'm going to ask that yes i'm gonna say "Officer I want to respect your wishes i want to cooperate are you
45:36 asking me to step out of the vehicle because you are placing me under arrest?" And if he says yes sure I'm
45:44 going to jail if he says no I just want to ask you some questions i'm sorry
45:49 officer i am not comfortable stepping out of my vehicle unless you are placing me under arrest mhm i'm not try I'm
45:56 trying to cooperate but I'm I'm scared you can ask me questions while I'm sitting here my car is off here you want
46:03 to take my keys take my keys mhm and that's I did not know that that's what I would do truthfully and that's if I'm
46:10 drinking or if I'm not drinking because if an officer is pulling you over because your tail light is out there's
46:16 no need for you to get out of the car for him to further investigate you right so right or if he's pulling me over
46:22 because I'm speeding okay write me my ticket i've had enough of those i know how that goes i've never had to be
46:28 stepped out of the car because I was speeding but if you're pulling me out of the car to ask me for other questions
46:33 that means you are trying to investigate another crime right i'm not getting out of the car respectfully and and also the
46:40 idea is it's not one thing I want to communicate to anyone listening this advice I I understand what you're saying
46:46 it's not it's a it's a means of deescalation because if they say yes we are go if you don't step out then I'm
46:53 going to arrest you then it's not a a matter of arguing and trying to just accept that L like okay I'm arrested if
47:00 they say to you blow into this I want to see if you're safe to drive or come out and do these I want to check your eyes
47:05 and make sure you're safe to drive No respectfully no i'm cooperating with you
47:11 you pulled me over for speeding or failing to maintain my lane your investigation of that has ended at the
47:18 time you approach my window and if he says you're not going to blow I'm going to arrest you you're going to jail regardless and plus just so another
47:25 question I get common is people are like "Well I didn't blow or I I I didn't give
47:31 them a test and they still arrested me or or something." And so the state administered test of your breath the
47:37 actual breathalyzer test that's not the one they do on the side of the road that's called a portable breath test or
47:43 an alka sensor that is just another test in their battery of field sobriety tests
47:49 the actual state test the actual breathalyzer that they use against you you they don't even get that until after
47:55 you're already arrested so they can't ask for that until you're already been placed under arrest and charged and
48:01 taken to the station mhm so at that point you're you're cooked already and
48:06 and the one at the station can you refuse the one at the station as well so you can refuse all of the tests now
48:13 there are consequences to your driver's license if you refuse the breathalyzer test or a blood test so after after
48:20 you've been arrested after you're in handcuffs in the back of the car or whatever you're clearly under arrest
48:26 that is the only time legally the officer can ask for a breath test or a blood test and he reads to you from a
48:34 green little card it's called the Georgia implied consent notice and Georgia law requires you to submit to a
48:40 test of your breath blood urine blah blah blah and then do you agree to submit to a test of your breath which is
48:46 the most common and if you don't your license may be suspended for one year
48:53 that's a hard suspension that implied consent comes in when people are applying for a driver's license is that
48:60 when the consent is implied like when you agree to that yes exactly so the you we we we it's not a right to drive we
49:07 have a it's a privilege to drive it's a privilege to have a driver's license and part of your agreement with
49:13 DDS Department driver services when you're getting your license says "Hey all right i get my license." And you
49:19 tell them if I'm ever investigated for a DUI and the officer reads this I'm going to give them a test right and if I don't
49:26 my license just expired my birthday you have the I have to go to the DMV you got to go to DMV you have the right to
49:33 travel freely you do not have the right to have a stateisssued driver's license
49:39 correct correct so let me say one thing right first of all I can't tell you how much I appreciate cops there's bad
49:46 apples everywhere absolutely yeah right me too like I love cop we live in in Cobb County yep right
49:52 cobb County police if something even small happens I
49:58 cannot tell you like a whole swat sticker in 10 seconds to protect you

50:05 right and so I've loved cops i owed I know there's bad apples cuz I mentioned
50:11 the Ryan they're doing their job right you know for the most part um a lot like defense attorneys like defense attorneys
50:18 on my or PI attorneys yeah um I always talk about the defense attorneys on the
50:23 PI on the PI side like they're not bad people but they're just doing their job right so I follow this lawyer thing on
50:31 social and I saw this and I was like is this actually possible so this guy
50:38 um this older man gets pulled over at a a DUI checkpoint or right and the cops
50:47 come up to him he barely cracks his window like this much and this is when
50:52 you were saying you don't have to get out of the car um they're like and he puts his license right there on the
50:59 window and he's he goes "My attorney told me not to answer any questions."
51:06 They're like "Have you been drinking?" My attorney told me not to answer any questions what do you need your driver's
51:13 license is right here can you roll your window down you can see it right here right like and they and he they kept
51:20 asking him questions and he was just like here's this here's he barely cracked his window I can still hear you
51:25 I can't hear you can you roll out your window can you get out of the like and they let him go like and just like he
51:33 literally did I was like can you actually do that you can I mean legally so a lot of times though keep in mind
51:39 you might get an obstruction charge on top of it but I would argue that's not obstruction I won't get into any trouble
51:45 I know I know I'm I'm in general but like you know yeah I mean depending on the cops they're 99% of cops are amazing
51:54 human beings we I work I'm the public defender in Alpharetta and Milton Municipal Court and we have and I mean
52:02 cop county we have some of the best law enforcement in the state of Georgia like we really do we're very very lucky and
52:09 they do an amazing job and they do their jobs and they do they do great work at the end of the day as a defense
52:18 attorney my job is to make sure that my that the state has proved their case
52:24 beyond a reasonable doubt right and met every element my job is not to get my clients off it's not it's not I'm not my
52:32 job is not to get you off or get you get the case dismissed against your that you're found innocent that is not my job
52:37 and I make that very clear with my clients like my job is to really truly investigate the evidence and make sure
52:43 that they can prove every element of the crime and prove their case beyond the reasonable doubt and that your constitutional rights are protected and
52:52 most of the time we are able to mitigate and find a resolution that is what is
52:58 best for my client i never ever sell myself as like "Nope we're going to get this dismissed we're going to I have no
53:03 idea what's going to happen on your case the first time I meet you i have no idea or what you're going through in life or
53:09 what you're going through in life or what's happening and what you need what is the best resolution for you because
53:14 an example this week I had a client who had a DUI and it was a very weak DUI
53:20 case and the prosecutor agreed but you know she agreed to reduce it to reckless driving which is a
53:26 win or we would have to send it up to the state court and my client was like "Well I
53:33 just I feel like we can win this." And I'm like "We can we probably can but at
53:39 what cost to you?" Mhm or you can take this plea and know what's exactly going
53:46 to happen and this is going to be done and over with it'll be off your record rather than sending it up to the state
53:52 court and having to drag it out again a you're going to have to pay me more money and b it's like more time and like
53:59 this is weighing very heavily on you like this is something that you wake up and think about every day yeah it's a
54:04 decision they have to make it's a decision he has to make right but like at what cost so part of my job is to
54:09 help my clients understand like no this isn't a complete dismissal maybe and it's not a not guilty completely but
54:17 ultimately for your mental health and for your sanity and what's best for your life in one year from now this truly
54:25 might be the best decision at this time because if we were to send it up to state court it would have dragged on for another year right and then he would
54:32 have had to and it would have started from scratch and after kind of like explaining it and really helping him
54:38 through because to me I it makes no difference in my world per se you know it's it's I'm going to fight it i'm
54:44 going to support my client whatever they want to do it's their case i would have made more money but that's not what I
54:50 that's not why I do what I do and so he rightfully I said "If you were my brother I would tell you as my brother
54:58 this is what you need to do now and this is what I recommend you do." And so that was the right resolution there were
55:04 times when I was doing criminal defense I had again being Persian members of my family that their a knee-jerk reaction
55:11 is like "You you represent criminals." Yeah i was like "No you you actually criminal defense attorneys they represent the United States
55:18 Constitution." Yeah essentially yeah because you're you have the client but you're just making sure that all of
55:24 their rights are are protected and and what I do specifically and I don't take
55:30 on a lot of cases i keep my practice very like boutique because I want to be able to provide that customized defense
55:38 every client's different every single client's different they can have the most similar case facts the same exact
55:45 officer the like the most similar case facts but the people are completely different and you cannot forget that
55:53 because what is best for one client may not be what's best for the other and vice versa so you really got to make
55:58 sure and dictate the resolutions and cases and not only just the resolution but how the case is handled i have
56:04 clients that I literally need to like handhold through everything and that's
56:09 okay yeah cuz I can usually tell after the first meeting but then I have clients who are like "Oh I don't want to
56:15 hear anything from you you just tell me where to send the money." Like they just don't care i mean I tell my kids like
56:21 "Everyone's human everyone makes mistakes everyone has issues everyone's family law taught me everyone's crazy
56:29 right different levels of cra of crazy." And I'm like if we can just
56:35 prevent 80% i know you're Yeah i know things will happen right in your control
56:42 you might be going through something right and you might make make a mistake
56:47 but no kind of like what can we do to prevent the mistakes get an Uber or
56:54 don't think you can drive or like you know don't talk don't talk yeah their
56:60 officer is telling you they're they're cool they're they understand California don't give it to them yeah and I made
57:07 that mistake like I'm not again I just play lawyer on TV 99% of people do because they it's natural and it's
57:14 natural you're right but I'm like if we could just prevent know your rights
57:20 right you know and I'm not saying know how to trick the system i'm saying just know what your rights are try to avoid
57:27 the situation to begin with you know if you're going to be in that situation how can we handle it best you know you just
57:33 said we're not trying to trick the system i think that I'm really happy you said that because a lot of people
57:38 think that way they're like "Oh well you're helping." No no no no we're not helping criminals get away with anything
57:44 our constitutionally protected rights that you're afforded if anything but people don't know i don't know like I
57:50 get Oh you're California oh cool you smoke too hey like yeah hang out one of
57:55 the most interesting thing that we've been having a lot of over every year politically it gets worse the disc
58:01 public discourse gets worse we hate each other more what the country gets a lot of flack and although we have a lot of
58:08 room for improvement I urge people to spend one day in criminal court with
58:13 with public defense attorneys not not privately retained counsel as
58:18 yourself where people have means those of us that don't have means to a defense
58:24 this country still provides defense and that is not common across the globe it's
58:31 one of those things that I really feel like sets us apart i'm getting goosebumps like I feel patriotic i really do no it is it's very
58:38 true i mean we have and we're really lucky like so like Fulton County has a
58:43 builtin public um defenders office and they are some of the best criminal
58:50 defense attorneys i mean when I get a client who calls me like a mom called me on behalf of her son and she's like
58:56 "Well he's got the public defender." And I'm like "Well which county?" She says "Folk." I'm saying "Ma'am listen if you
59:01 guys are truly indigent like that's going to be your best resource they are the some of the strongest and best
59:07 defense attorneys in this state the public defend Oh indigent indigent is um people who uh don't have the funds who
59:14 would qualify who are you know can't afford to hire a private attorney got it." And um Thank you and they are you
59:22 know they really are they're some of the best attorneys in the state we have other counties nearby like Cobb County
59:28 and um Forsythe County um they have an appointed list in Gwynet County as well
59:35 so they don't have like a built-in public defender's office but they have private defense attorneys who are on
59:40 this list that people can apply and qualify for if they cannot afford to hire private counsel so you're getting a
59:46 private defense attorney who's going to be able to help you through the process and work through the system um so you
59:52 know we are as citizens of this great state and country we are afforded those
59:57 rights that you're like you said are not common anywhere else in the world they're just not
60:03 i'm sorry about that weird clip i'm dressed in something completely different but I did need to jump in and
60:08 let you know that that is the first part of a two-part series because I had such
60:14 an amazing time speaking with Alvaro and Manel that we completely lost track of
60:22 time and it went over almost 3 hours so what we've done is we've edited and
60:27 condensed it into two separate parts this was part one i hope you got a lot out of it this was about what to do
60:35 mostly with law enforcement how to handle traffic stops uh some
60:41 consumeroriented information coming from some attorneys that hopefully you guys can use part two if you tune in for next
60:48 week we get into well we get a little bit personal we talk about some mental
60:54 health issues uh some of the exercises we've gone through and just how everyone
60:59 regardless of age or occupation what it is that we go through some of the
61:05 battles that everyone faces and and how best to handle that and support each other as always I'm doing this to help
61:12 support all of you you could support me by sharing this podcast and tuning in
61:18 and also if you've got any advice if there's anything that you'd like to hear about if there's a topic I can discuss
61:23 that would be of importance to you or if you'd like to be a guest if you think that you've got some wisdom or advice or
61:31 information that you want to share with the world we've got a platform ready for you we'd love to have you on thank you
61:37 for listening to today's episode and for part two make sure to tune in next week
61:43 take care