Title: 🎙️ Navigating Law, Life & DUI Laws
Downloaded: 2025-12-30 09:38:13

[Music] Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of the Auto Accident Attorneys Podcast. I'm your host, Attorney Ali. The podcast, as always, is sponsored by the Auto Accident Attorneys Group. We take care of you. On today's episode, I'm so excited to have colleagues and personal friends of mine. I've got who I like to lovingly refer to as Professor Arouse. I've got Alvaro Arouse of the 3A law firm law management. Law management company. Welcome, Alvo. Thank you for having me. I've got Miss Manell like Chanel Caruso of Shahimi Law, criminal defense attorney, fantastic attorney, even better friend.

Manell, thank you so much for coming today. So nice. Thanks for having me. Happy to be here. I love seeing your beautiful faces and you guys are very close. So, I'm so happy that you are both on the same episode. But I feel like the conversation is going to naturally flow and Alvo can essentially take over probably take over my job, right? Yeah. She's like a little sister. Yeah. Right. Uh you might be like a step brother. She's more like little sister. I have a bigger place in your heart. Yeah. But I think Ally still has a good place in your heart, too.

I love that. Thank you. Let's start to just sort of fall into this. I know that you're coming off of uh an evening with fellow attorneys and colleagues from Johnny's Hideway. Slowly ease into this and you tell us about yourself. Yeah, don't talk too fast. My synapses aren't firing quite quick enough. Um, uh, I always say I'm just a long-haired hippie from San Francisco and, uh, dropped out of med school to be a writer and ended up, uh, working with lawyers, which I never thought and just created this company.

It's in 47 states and 18 countries and it's just and it's 100% referral. So, it's just crazy that I So, I'm like, I just made this up and but by the time I'm done talking, you'll understand. I love that. Yeah, I love that about you. Yeah. So, you are also a natural connector. Yeah. So, I didn't realize um the power and the value of having a a diverse network, right? um not only because you might need that person or somebody that they know, right? Um or anybody out there might need them, right? Um, but I realized the general counsel for GE, like the appliances out of um, Michigan was going to go out on her own and was referred to me by a DC client.

And she was uh, she did employment and she said, "Uh, why should I hire you?" And I go, "Well, I do this." And she's like, "I'm number one in the world in that." I'm like, "Well, I do, you know, I can help with this. a second, you know, all marketing things. And then by the time I get to like number six, I'm like, "Well, I know people." She goes, "That's exactly why I'm hiring you. I want you to connect me." And so that opened up a whole like the lawyer's dinner club, you know, it's just it's one of these things where I bring the right personalities who can help one another, but then also help their clients, right?

So, it's been fun. And I think that's such an important skill set outside of we're talking we're sitting with attorneys and you're in the legal industry, but it's such an important thing just in life in general. Yeah, totally. I mean, I said like I joke everyone assumes I'm an attorney, but I joke I'm like I just play one on TV. I mean, but I'm a normal person, you know, and I think you can apply this in any aspect of your life, you know. You don't have to be a lawyer. I'm not a lawyer. You know, you can be just be you, but know how to connect the dots and the people.

I'm Persian. We'll get into that background and compare and contrast with Manell. Uh Persian parents are pretty strict and especially on my younger sister. So, she was the girl growing up. And my mom used to always tell her like, you know, stop going out so much. Stay home. I don't want you to go out. And I remember I'm 10 years older than Holly. And I remember telling my mom, I'm like, "Hey, that's the worst advice." I was in I had just graduated college. I was like, "That's the worst advice. Don't tell her to stop going out.

She should go out. What she should stop doing is going out with the same group of people every single day." Yeah. Go expand your network. Correct. And that's what people do. They're like, I want to, you know, meet new people. But they end up crowding with the same group just like you said. Oh, no. It's just don't be afraid to get out there and be yourself. And I think one thing that you are really good at, Alvo, is it's, you know, it's not just about the quantity of the connections, it's also the quality.

And I think that's just obviously, especially in a business standpoint, is just as important because yeah, you can connect me with everybody, anybody that I might need, but it's it's quality referral, which you did, but it's also the quality referral, and that's that's what's important, too. And um I think you professionally and personally achieved that. Thank you. Yeah. Great job, Ala. I hope that made you feel better. It Yeah. Yeah. I mean I mean No, it just I got to the point where I used to care what other people think, you know.

Um and talk about your parents. So my parents were in medicine, right? So, that's how I was going to, but I've left and super strict. My brother and sister are professional athletes. I'm not clearly I'm built like a 13-year-old boy, but I'm deceptively athletic. Um, and so I went to this all boy super high-end school, got shipped to Paris to go to Serbone, but I was a club kid in Tampa, so I hated Paris. So I came back um and I was an academic scholar so I had a scholarship. So I signed up for all these classes uh calc physics philosophy and the counselor's like don't do this don't do this and I was like shut up I went to judge fine.

So you can't take that case load and go clubbing six nights a week. So I lost my I got a 0.7. Nice. as yeah 0.7 right I lost my scholarship um I uh got up put on probation and my parents ship me to Brazil to go to med school oh my gosh but that's what has given us what Alvaro is today I want to come back to Brazil but before we get too far down that road I want to provide Minnell an opportunity to introduce herself and and let's hear awesome a you're sweet okay so So, I'm Minnell Caruso. I'm a criminal defense attorney.

Um, I have my own firm, Shahimi Law. I started it in 2017. I've been practicing since 2012. I was managing partner at a firm uh for a few years before I went off on my own. And um I love it. I do. I genuinely do. Professionally, that's I can't imagine doing anything else than being a criminal defense lawyer and having my own firm. Um, I don't think I would love it as much if I wasn't on my own. Um, personally, I'm a mom. I have two beautiful boys who are just my world. And, uh, they they drive me crazy and I love them so much.

Uh, yeah. So, you're a boy mom. I'm a girl dad. So, we have the dynamics. Do you think you were always supposed to be a girl dad? Because like I know for sure I was supposed to be a boy mom. I It's so funny that you asked that because I I never thought about being married ever since I was a kid. I I never imagined a wedding or having a wife, but I always imagined being a dad. Yeah. As a boy, I always imagined being a dad to boys. And when my first daughter was when during the ultrasound for the first pregnancy, when it turned out that it was female, I went through a minor depressive episode and that's when the first graze showed up.

Now I look at it and I think that I was meant to be a girl dad because it opened up things about myself that I didn't know existed. Yeah. Had I been a boy dad, I would have I would have loved my life. I would have been moving forward, but I wouldn't know the things that I know now cuz I would have been more sensitive and aware. Absolutely. 100%. Yeah. There's a saying, and I'm going to totally butcher it, but I think I'll get the gist of it, where it's like, um, God gives you firstborn as as a boy, gives you a boy as your firstborn, or a boy as your child to teach you the love that you never had.

Oh, wow. And there's some other one for girl dads, which I'm sorry I didn't really pay attention to, but I'll find it and I'll share it with I I think the moment you have a kid, right, and people just don't understand like you just you can't explain it in a way like oh I have a dog and it's like you have no idea that the minute you have that first child or any child um you completely lost your ego because before that moment everything was decided in your life based on what you want. Sure. Once you have a kid out the window.

Yeah. you've like the concept of time like all those things. So I we have three kids. We have uh boy and I thought we were done and she's like let's let's go for three. I go why do you want three boys? She goes cuz it might be a girl. Yeah. Right. And and she's like I don't care either way. If it's a boy it's a boy. So it ended up being a girl. Right. So we've got two boys and a girl which is our same dynamic. You know, I have an older brother and a younger sister, and I had met her like in between meetings for the ultrasound, and by the time I got home, there were two tables of just mounds of pink everywhere, right?

But I mean, siblings, they're the longest relationship you'll ever have in your life, right? True. And they'll always be with you. and to see them develop like I can see my influence and Elizabeth's influence but they have their own little personalities in my soul and and to see that you know as they grow up it's just they're the funnest toys. Yeah, they are. They're Gosh, it changes your world for sure. It's my favorite thing to do. And I was very similar to you Ally. I never I never marriage was never on my radar.

I mean I was and being a Middle Eastern girl like it's different but I never even cared for I always wanted to be a mom and in fact I was on that journey and then co shut me down and then I met my husband which again is a whole other podcast episode everything that transpired with my husband who um very suddenly passed away um on my birthday on on Alvo's birthday. He reminds me of that every year you know it's my he hates it. I hate for you, Albert. I know. I'm sorry for you, Albert. That came out. I know.

It came out perfect. It came out perfect for our relationship. But yeah, so um it's just I know for sure though that I was supposed to be a boy mom because I I don't have that. It's I have three brothers and I was raised like a boy. like my dad made. That's what makes her I think that's why we connected cuz she's not a normal. Yeah. You know, but man, she's normal. She's not a normal girl. I mean, like, tell. So, this is how Alvar and I met. We uh I graduated in 2012 and sat for the bar and then, you know, you're sitting there for three months.

Like, what do I do with my life until the bar results come out? And I was like, well, I need money. I need to start working. And I started interviewing and Alvaro, I had no idea. I thought he was a lawyer. Um, I replied, I think it was like a Craigslist ad or something. And it was at an it was at a law firm. It was a criminal defense firm. Is it Craig Jacobs? Yes. Estate. No, it was King King and Kings. Uh, Jacob's King. Jacob. So Scott did criminal estate. Yes. And so I went and I interviewed and Alvaro was conducting the interview and he kind of introduced himself kind of not and we after what it was like 20 minutes in he goes I really like you.

I really like you a lot but I don't like you for this job. I'm not going to offer you this job. I was like okay. And then he was like but let me tell you what I do. And then he told me what he did and that he's a law firm consultant and he helps lawyers basically build and grow their firms and connects people and yeah so and that's what happened. He connected me with Don Turner who whose reputation preceded him. May he rest in peace. He passed away also in 2023. But um so he connected me with Don and then literally a week later I was having lunch with him and Don and then Don offered me a job and I started working for Dawn before I passed the bar and became partner and I became partner within two years of that of and I basically took over the firm from day one.

Um the day I got my bar results, you know, it was a Friday. Monday morning, Judge Berford in Cobb County Superior Court was swearing me in in his chambers at like 7:30 in the morning. He swore me in and then he literally goes, "All right, counselor, you have a case on my calendar. Come on." I was like, "Wait, don't I have to like get a number?" And he's like, "No, it's my courtroom." So, Judge Bford took me into his court into a courtroom and it was this massive calendar call and we did have a case on calendar and Don goes, "All right, I'll see you back at the office." And literally dipped out.

And that's like I love Biver. He's got um I was like, "Is this even allowed?" Like, so I did I he called the case and it was a case that had already been negotiated for a null pros, which is a dismissal. And so I I stood up and I said, "I'm here on that case." And I believe the state has a motion. And the prosecutor said, "Yeah, judge, we're we're going to null pro blah blah blah." And Judge Bifford goes, "Now, Miss Shahimi, tell the court how long you've been practicing." And I literally looked at my watch.

I go, "Oh, like 45 minutes." And he goes, "4 minutes and you've got your first dismissal. I think you're off to a good start." And I was so sweet and so memorable and I'll cherish that memory forever and and the way he handled it cuz clearly Yeah. Like clearly I should not legally have been practicing law because I think I needed to be like filed. But it's his courtroom and that's why he's like it's my court. That's beautiful. That's a great anecdote. Yeah. Since you you said null pros and most of our listeners are uh consumers and my mother my mom hates every time I mention her because she thinks I'm making fun of her but I Oh, mom and June.

I love you mom. Thank you for listening. I love you too. We love you too, M. Um so they're consumers. So null pros. Yeah, Latin. Yeah. For we will not prosecute or we will not Yeah. And so it's basically a fancy way to say your case is dismissed. And so if somebody is facing criminal charges, u yeah, when they get that, that's a that's a win. You get that and you run as fast as you can out of the courtroom without committing any more crimes. But no, um a null process obviously magic. It's it's the equivalence to a not-uilty verdict without having to go through the not guilty process.

Ideally, one of the things I like about her is her self-confidence, you know, and I think for Bifford to have done that and to have gotten that dismissal just like cemented. Yeah. You know, because she was just naturally self-confident. Like that's one of the things I liked about her. I still like about um it's the fact that she went out on a like her first swing was a home run. Yeah. Like then it's like, "All right, let's go." Starting. So, it was poetic. It was really cool. And um yeah, I mean because So that was 12 2012.

That was October 31st. It was Halloween. Wow. Yeah. Cuz bar results came out that Friday. So it was like that following Monday or something. So almost 13 years, huh? Yeah. Spooky dismissal. A spooky dismissal. But yeah, so in practical terms on a null pros, yeah, if somebody is looking for a job and they have to fill out uh an employment application, what are the ramifications of a null pros? What what do you have to report and what do you not? Sure. So it depends on how the question is asked, right? So if someone's like if the question is, have you ever been arrested?

Well, I mean, yes. Even if your case is ultimately dismissed the process or dismissed via other another operation of law, you were arrested and you were fingerprinted and that's always going to be there for law enforcement purposes. It's never fully expuned or restricted. So my thing is always be truthful. That's going to be my advice in those situations because ultimately you can further explain. Generally with job applications they give you that opportunity of saying hey if the answer to this is yes please further explain here and at that point you can then answer and say now there's other operations of law can I go ahead couple questions because I tell my kids this it pays to be precise with your question um if you do answer yes like um is it best to keep it very short?

Yeah, it depending and on the employer and the question what you think they're going to want to see. Now, if it's a sales job and it's your first time out of college and it's like a competitive field and you're dealing with like a recruiter or someone in HR, I think it's better to be a little bit more forthcoming and say, "Hey, this was a bogus issue, something crazy, and ultimately it was dismissed because it should have been. But yeah, unfortunately I was arrested and did get us to this point, but this has nothing to do with my life now or even then and this is the person I am.

Um, if it's something else, I mean, and it might not even come up a lot of times if it is restricted. Now, the law changed, I want to say in 2015, the law changed with um, record restriction that allows things to be just automatically done in the court system. And so, if it doesn't come up, it doesn't come up. And just real quick, while it's on my mind, an arrest is not a conviction, right? Correct. So if the question is, have you ever been convicted of a crime? And you haven't, then you can truthfully say no.

Yeah. Right. But once a mug shot's out there. Yeah. I mean, it's But so that's a null process, right? I've had qui no pro qua quai. Null pro r o. That's why we shortened it because we don't know how to say it. Eq UI. So we just say null pros. She don't deal with the last rest of the letters. So, I've had a couple friends ask me, "Hey, I need a lawyer because I have this record or I have this mole." So, you've got this on here. When would you want It's called an expungement. Yeah, it is an expungement, but really what it's referred to now is a record restriction.

I'm not a lawyer. I just spray one on TV. You're a consumer today. So basically depending on the operation of the element that got us to that result, your record will either be automatically restricted or you have to go through certain steps to get it restricted. Who should get an expungement? Well, it depends. Yeah. Isn't that the best lawyer answer ever? It depends because the only lawyer answer. I'm going to give you um an example. Okay, so let's say your case is just flatout dismissed because it truly was bogus and that you had nothing to do like you never should have been arrested.

Like it was wild, but you still have a mug shot, right? You can go through channels to get that restricted removed off your record. But again, if I'm interviewing for like a big company and I really want that job, I'm not going me personally, I'm not going to sit there and like gamble and be like, I'm just not going to tell them about this cuz it was [ __ ] you know? Yeah. I'm going to be forthcoming and say that that's me and be like, listen, I was arrested. It was dismissed. It's it was technically restricted, but there's always ways that it can potentially be found.

So, that's one scenario. Another scenario is in the instance of like um a pre-trial diversion program. So, for example, uh we see this a lot in cases of like theft by shoplifting or misdemeanor, marijuana, um sometimes felony or um like family violence battery cases. For example, in Fulton County where I practice a lot, a firsttime offender, Fulton County, um simple battery, family violence, husband and wife get into a dispute, some hands are laid on each other. It's like a one-time incident. I mean, it happens.

Okay? It's not right, but it happens. Husband or wife get arrested a lot of times. Um, depending on the allegations and their record in exchange for them completing a 24-week family violence intervention program and some community service and paying like a fee, the the solicitor's office will offer them a diversion program. And it's a great avenue for first-time offenders. It's a great resolution for these types of cases. And it's not a guarantee. you're not guaranteed to get it. Um, but a lot of times that's a win for for us.

And so it's like, okay, let's do this. Let's complete it. And the the end result is a dismissal, a null pros, and the record restriction. So the client can truthfully say, I was never convicted of this. You don't plead to anything. You're not So it's it's a it's a safe it's a safety net. It's a fail safe for them. So that is supposed to be an immediate record restriction. Once the dismissal, the null process entered into by the clerk's office, that's transmitted to the GBI, which is the Georgia Bureau of Information, and that is supposed to be what restricts it from your record.

Again, law enforcement and certain security checks and certain clearances will always see that. They's no way to officially effectively one million% remove it. It ends if you're connected, though. Well, I guess. Yeah. Do you know Donald? Because I could use a connect to Donald. Um I uh I have this story about that one time I never actually got arrested. Yeah. So, I was going to I listen to music and I need alone time sometimes because I'm around a lot of people and I'm driving and the office is right outside of South Carolina.

So, it's like a two-hour drive. I'm like, I'll do it. Right. So, and this was years ago. Um, and so I had weed in my car, but I put it in my glove box. Um, and I'm like, well, after this meeting, after I'm done working, I'll smoke a bowl. Right. So, I'm driving down this highway. It's a two-lane highway. Bunch of like um semitrs. Is it two lanes? One way each way, maybe. Yeah. Um, and I'm just I'm I'm almost there. It's like 7:30 in the morning and through this and I'm going like 65 and through this blind like turn these two teenagers blow through the stop sign and so and I'm going like 65 so I couldn't even say oh [ __ ] It was just like what?

And then bam, right? Full speed. Spun around. They hit you or you hit them? I hit them because they blew through them. I t-boned broke the kid's leg one guy's arm. Right. Spun around. Spun around like Right. And so knowing lawyers, I was like, "Right." Um, and I kept looking for my car keys so that I could unlock the glove box, right, and get rid of the And it was like Yeah. It was just like a nug. It's not like I was rolling with pounds. Like I wasn't back. You weren't trafficking. Yeah. Correct. Right. And uh personal use is what we would say in a legal defense.

That's a just personal use. Yeah. So I get in the ambulance. I can never find it. Right. So I get in and I've never been in a car wreck. I've never been like touched by cop. Like so I was just like get in the ambulance. I get the ambulance like I have four herniated discs and stuff. So the cop comes in super cool also from California, right? and he's telling me telling me, you know, kind of what happened and everything. I'm like, "Hi, the kids." And he starts to walk out and he comes back in. He goes, "Oh, one more question." Oh, no.

What was in that Tupperware box in your glove box? I'm like, "What are you talking about?" He's like, "Well, when we tow cars, we have to make inventory of what was in the car, right? What was that?" I'm like, "I don't know." And he goes, "Dude, it's totally cool. I do it, too. It's It's just not technically legal right now." He goes, "I know, dude. I'm from California. I know, but it's not technically." And I was like, "It's not mine." He's like, "Well, who uses your car?" I go, "I valet all the time.

I have no idea." Right. And I woke up early and I just left. Right. So, he's just like slow baiting me and I'm so hurt and like I'm like, "Dude, it's mine." He's like, "All right. I'm going to have to arrest you. Oh my gosh. Right. And I'm in like 2 hours away. I have no car. I'm in the hospital. I hope the listeners paid attention to that line of questioning. Dude, it's okay. It's okay. He totally baited me. He totally baited me. Cops are not your friends when they're investigating a crime. They are in general, but not when they're investigating a crime.

He He just left. Like he was there for 20 minutes. He leaves. He could Oh, one more. Just Just a little bit. Just tiny little bit like And I here I am like where's San Francisco to like you know what part of San Francisco? Oh you're from California too. I want to be your friend. Oh yeah. So uh he goes but listen man I understand what's happening. It was on a Thursday. He's like just come back Monday. Um I'm not going to do anything right now. Come back Monday. It'll be like a 4hour process. We'll book you in. We'll fingerprint you.

Like he explains what's going to happen. He's just but just remember you go get like okay fine right so I get out of the hospital who do I call immediately my clients right I knew she was busy so I busy I called I think you're in labor probably probably you weren't even licensed that's why um so I call who I need to call right in terms of being connected it's a very important do you want to say who you called or Mike Hawkins. Of course I would call Mike Cawkins. Mike who I would call. Okay. Mike Hawkins represented Coach Bud when he got his DUI dismissed.

That being said, he still got a mug shot. Coach Bud, right? But Coach Bud, who was coaching for Atlanta, used to work for the San Antonio Spurs. Okay. And Mike Hawkins was the dean of the National College of DUI defense. like this guy knows deal like he is Jamal Anderson like you name. So Bud calls the team lawyer for the Spurs who went to school with Mike Hawkins and so Hawkins gets Bud gets it like dismissed, right? But one of his cases was a vehicular homicide. Um a Georgia State Patrol, not Coach Bud's case.

This is a different This is a different but that Mike handled, right? Okay. So, um, there was a baseball coach for the Braves, um, who wife was killed by a Georgia State Patrolman who blew through a right in a chase or whatever. And Mike Hopkins did the vehicular homicide case for Georgia State Patrol. So, I called Mike. I go, "Mike, I'm in trouble." Right? He calls the head of Georgia State Patrol, who's his friend, and he goes, "Hey, I need a favor. Can can you talk to So the head of Georgia State calls the trooper and tells him the story?" And he's like, "I'm cool with it.

If the prosecutor's cool with it, of course, Mike knows prosecutor." Prosecutor's like, "Totally fine. Not a problem. Got it." Like so the one time I never got arrested is because of who you connection networking it's important and I make mistakes like and trust me guess who doesn't travel anymore during I don't travel like a first god dank I'm glad I'm alive those kids are alive yeah like I'm glad you know um it worked out the way it I mean but it teaches you stuff but it's also important not to just stay in your little hole on your phone video game.

Get out there, network, be a good person. Yeah. You drove and learning lessons along the way, too. I I know you had a driver bring you here today about, you know, around the same time doing what I do. My clients have a lot of events. So, I'm I might have on top of a a full day three events in one night. And I've got to do my round. It's like speed dating. Hey, how's it going? Yeah. Everything good? Right. Let's grab lunch. Blah blah blah. Yeah. Right. But I could do that. And then a lot of times people come with me and like, "Hey, we're going to Johnny's.

Who wants to go?" Right. And knowing lawyers, there's usually alcohol. I kind of like it myself. And I just know not to make mistakes. Yeah. Right. Like I'm not losing I'm not getting in an accident. I'm not killing anybody. I'm not like leaving my kids. Like I'm not doing that. So I would just re So I've had Irvin for since my first at least 12 13 years like he come he Thanksgiving Halloween like he takes me everywhere you know and so last night I was out all day in meetings I left my car in Buckhead because I knew I had all these events last night and yeah so he picked me up this morning brought me here.

is waiting for me outside. I love it. Even Irvin, even the driver, that's part of your network. Yeah. Swervven Irvin, that's what we call. I love that name. Yeah. As a recap of of the pragmatic advice, if the application question is about an arrest, that is you're always truthful. But if it's an arrest, whether you're convicted or not, you're still arrested, right? If it's a if they're asking if you've been convicted, that's Yeah. And then if you haven't been convicted, then you say, "No, I have not been convicted." And there's different ways to avoid a conviction even after arrest.

OJ Simpson said, "Right, I didn't do it." Um, but no, so like, you know, the pre-trial diversion scenario with the family violence case is one. Then there's also um Georgia's First Offender Act, which is another way to avoid a conviction. And that would be um a similar situation where you would with that case though in that situation if you plead under the Georgia offenders act you would say I'm pleading guilty and a sentence would be imposed but what happens is the judge doesn't sign that sentence and he holds it literally they hold your sentence and for the probated amount of time whether it's one year five years whatever and then if you successfully complete the terms of that probated sentence, um that sentence is ripped up and shredded and a discharge and a quiddle is submitted to the GBI again to show to restrict your record to show that you were not convicted.

So in certain cases like drug possession or even um you know assaults or felony serious felonies um if you are eligible for the Georgia first offender I mean it's a great alternative to potentially ruining someone's life for a one-time mistake or um you know thing that is not of their nature. Most of my clients are normal people. I mean, they're run-of-the-mill people who made a bad decision one time or, you know, had a bad day. You know, it's not like their career or hang out or hanging out with the wrong people wrong time.

It might not be the wrong person, right? Like, so, um, one thing I've learned is, and this is from my family lawyers and my criminal lawyers, is let's say you're going through a divorce. Obviously you guys are yelling and fighting and liking each other, right? When emotions are high. Yeah. Right. People turn into different like a next level. Right. And one phone call. I'm so mad at you. I'm so mad at you. One phone call to 911. Right. Right. Here comes domestic violence. Here terroristic threats, terrorists assault.

All this stuff. Right. Spirals out of control. it spirals and it could be on even a [ __ ] phone call. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So, also knowing how easy it is and then the consequences of what might cuz even a mug again once you have a mug shot, you have a mug shot, right? So if you're going through a divorce or if you're with I mean somebody who at that moment in time sure is going to agitate you and lose control or they're going to lose control or you're remove yourself from the situation cuz they can get you in trouble for the rest of your life.

The best legal advice I'd give people especially this pertains mostly I think for DUIs and this is for all consumers everybody. If you're committing a crime you cannot commit more than one crime at the same time. Right. Explain that. Yeah. For example, let's talk about DUIs. It's not illegal to drink and drive. It's illegal to drink and drive with your BAC being above a 008 if you're over 21. Okay. Oh, it man, if you're going to drink and drive, even if it's one beer or 10 beers, first of all, don't. That's my number one piece of advice.

Don't do it. If we're already there and you're doing it, you cannot commit another crime while in the process of committing a current crime of drinking and driving, that means your seat belt is on, your turn signals are being used, you're making complete stops at every stop sign, your tags, you're maintaining your lane, your tags are in order, your brake lights are in order. Correct. So, that's what I'm saying. Like you won't know like if your headlight is out or a tail like what are some of the top re like tags expired pull you they're looking the handsree being just holding your phone your phone I've had more of those DUI related cases in the last two years than I've had in my whole career as being the reasonable articulable suspicion for the stop is that oh they were on their phone or they're holding their phone because they're looking on GPS or something right I mean that's had I've had more of those cases I've been meaning to change my brake light.

They're not pulling them over because they suspect them of drunk driving. They're pulling them over for something completely different. And then they typically ask, "Right, have you had any?" Well, and it depends. They use that they use that as a tool. Like I'm going to tell you, I'm be honest with you. If it's like 12:00 in the afternoon, you're driving down Alpharetta and there's a cop and he sees you on your phone, he may not likely pull you over or a broken tail light. But if it's at 2 a.m. 2 a.m. or midnight or and you know and you're you're on your phone for a split second to put it up on your hands-free device, you're not even supposed to do that while you're operating the vehicle.

That's that's enough reasonable article suspicion to pull you over because he's like, "Oh, well maybe she's she's it's late. She was drinking." And then that goes into the DUI investigation. Another piece of dad advice, don't be out on the road at unreasonable hours. Yeah, that's what my parents say. Nothing good happens. Nothing good happens after midnight. Well, the advice is if if you're I mean, I'm I'm older now. I don't want to be out after midnight. But for my kids, when they listen, if it's going to be after midnight, don't definitely don't go in anyone else's car.

Get the Uber out a driver. Absolutely. It's not worth it. The 20 bucks, the 30 bucks, even a hundred bucks. Even 100. Listen, the DUI is going to a first lifetime DUI on average. I mean, minimum of five grand a minimum. Crazy. And that's like for a cheap lawyer and who's still a good lawyer, but they're just their fees are less. I mean, after you add in all the mandatory conditions, you're going to have to do the bail, the time, the classes, the classes themselves, and then the lawyer's fees, and then the fines, even if they get rid of the DUI.

Most jurisdictions in the state of Georgia, you get punished for a DUI. So, a beautiful paying $10,000 for an $80 Uber ride. A beautiful resolution in DUIs is reckless driving, which is a traffic offense, and it falls off your record. It goes away. There's no license suspension. It's four points on your record unless you're able to plead n. But you get punished in the same way you would if you had just pled guilty to the DUI in terms of the community service hours, the alcohol and drug evaluation, the risk reduction class, the MAD victim impact panel, the probation and the fines and the fees.

Again, I'm not a lawyer. Like I'm just a normal per like a literally a normal p. I mean, you guys are too, right? But well, I'm a superhero. I'm just saying that also it still baffles me that I do what I do, right? like that people come to me for advice. Like lawyers come to me for advice and how much I charge I think is a like it's crazy. I know. You're cheap. You're affordable. Yeah. Right. But it's valuable. They they come to me with questions and lawyers are lawyers. I have to be right. Right. But I'm a normal person.

I always say the lawyers have taught me so much about what to do, like what to avoid, how to be smart, things I don't even think about, like change your bra. Yeah. You know, like little tiny tiny things. Make sure your lights are on. Like that's another thing. I have automatic. That's how coach Bud got. I have automatic lights. My kids, as you know, they love to sit in the cars and just mess with and press buttons and I let them because it buys me 10 minutes of like quiet time. Yeah. But I can't tell you the number of times my kids have turned my automatic lights off and I do not realize it.

Yeah. Immediately. And then it's like, whoa, wow. Those, you know, but again, 12:00 in the afternoon, cops aren't going to Right. You know, that's not a big deal. I mean, but you bet your butt right when the sun starts setting it becomes a big deal. a sad and and along the lines of aside from the time, another sad truth of the universe is also the type of vehicle, you know. Yeah. If you've got a brand new S500, you're less likely. Depends where you are, right? You know, like if you're in an area like Milton Alpharetta where everyone's driving nice luxurious vehicles, that's just who we have to pull.

That's who the cops have to deal with. But yeah, I still Ryan Williams. No. No. The name doesn't sound familiar. Is he an attorney? He's an attorney. I might know him. Oh, I do know I saw him. He's African American. Okay. Okay. He's been pulled over and he and he's he's a lawyer. He's smart, but he's real. He's been pulled over, I think, like 15 times in all different types of vehicles because he has, you know, he's has a successful practice. He and and so it might be this kind of car. They're normal cars. or nothing.

It's not like a Bugatti. It's Oh, we forgot a Ferrari or anything like they're normal cars, but for 15 times like he just posted last week. Yeah. He had four cops descend on him for like no for no reason, right? Like like your tint, which was legal. like he's never done anything, but he keeps getting pulled over by cops, right? And it's just it sucks. But I'm glad that he posts about it because it's a real thing. Like you think you're just doing nothing, but chances are like there was an attorney who used to do a lot of um DUIs and he used to joke around.

He's retired now, but he used to tell me that, you know, he his office was in Atlanta in Buckhead and he would wake up at like 4 in the morning sometimes and not be able to sleep. So, he's like, I'm just going to go ahead head to the office. And this is when the Nighthawks were prevalent in Atlanta, which is the Georgia State Patrol like DUI Division that they do the the night scene. They still do that, but they there's still nighthawks out there. It's not as big, I don't think. Anyways, so he said he would used to drive and just like coast a little bit out of the lane just to purpose just just on purpose just to see if you get pulled over because he was clearly sober.

But like you got to go and mess with GSP right now. Don't do that. You know, speaking about being pulled over as an inevitability, another thing. So, Minnell, I don't know if I've ever told you this, but I started out in criminal defense. Yeah, I thought you did that a little bit. It was out in California. Yeah. And um which is a whole different like world out there. I feel it is just the system. Yeah, that's why we get along. One thing that dawned on me after doing a handful of cases before I switched over to personal injury was that I had never met anyone that ever had ever talked themselves out of a charge or an arrest in front of a cop.

Yeah. In other words, people think that they can explain their way out of something because they don't want to get arrested. They think they feel they might be able to avoid the rest. Right. So, I've gotten to the point where I tell my own family members, I'm like, "Shut your mouth." Yes. More truthfully, actually say, "Shut the [ __ ] up." Yeah. Yeah. Please. And they're like, "Well, they'll they'll arrest me." Like, that's fine. Yeah. I don't know how we got like down this rabbit hole of get cops and getting arrested and stuff, but one of the questions I get a lot, which let's say we make a mistake one night.

Yeah. and you get pulled over and you just said, "Shut the [ __ ] up." Yeah. Right. Everyone's like, "What do I say to a person?" I'll tell you, I know this. I this I have this conversation. I have this conversation all the time because I get people all the time asking. So, I do a lot of DUIs. DUIs are like my main focus. I pivoted my um criminal defense practice. I'm not doing major felonies anymore. So, I do a lot of DUIs. I've taught DUI seminars. Anyways, if you are being pulled over and the cop is asking you to step out of the vehicle, there is a very very very very good chance you're going to jail regardless.

So, if I were pulled over and the cop was asking me to step out of the vehicle and I had not had any alcohol or I was not under the influence of any alcohol at all, let's just say you are though. Okay. Well, I'm going to give you both smears cuz honestly my answer is the same. Okay. I will not step out of the vehicle unless I'm you're arresting me. So, I'm going to ask that. Yes. I'm gonna say, "Officer, I want to respect your wishes. I want to cooperate. Are you asking me to step out of the vehicle because you are placing me under arrest?" And if he says yes, sure, I'm going to jail.

If he says no, I just want to ask you some questions. I'm sorry, officer. I am not comfortable stepping out of my vehicle unless you are placing me under arrest. Mhm. I'm not try I'm trying to cooperate, but I'm I'm scared. You can ask me questions while I'm sitting here. My car is off here. You want to take my keys? Take my keys. Mhm. And that's I did not know that. That's what I would do truthfully. And that's if I'm drinking or if I'm not drinking. Because if an officer is pulling you over because your tail light is out, there's no need for you to get out of the car for him to further investigate you.

Right. So, right. Or if he's pulling me over because I'm speeding. Okay. Write me my ticket. I've had enough of those. I know how that goes. I've never had to be stepped out of the car because I was speeding. But if you're pulling me out of the car to ask me for other questions, that means you are trying to investigate another crime, right? I'm not getting out of the car. respectfully and and also the idea is it's not one thing I want to communicate to anyone listening this advice I I understand what you're saying it's not it's a it's a means of deescalation because if they say yes we are go if you don't step out then I'm going to arrest you then it's not a a matter of arguing and trying to just accept that L like okay I'm arrested if they say to you blow into this I want to see if you're safe to drive or come out and do these I want to check your eyes and make sure you're safe to drive No.

Respectfully, no. I'm cooperating with you. You pulled me over for speeding or failing to maintain my lane. Your investigation of that has ended at the time you approach my window. And if he says you're not going to blow, I'm going to arrest you. You're going to jail regardless. And plus, just so another question I get common is people are like, "Well, I didn't blow or I I I didn't give them a test and they still arrested me or or something." And so the state administered test of your breath, the actual breathalyzer test, that's not the one they do on the side of the road.

That's called a portable breath test or an alka sensor. That is just another test in their battery of field sobriety tests. The actual state test, the actual breathalyzer that they use against you, you they don't even get that until after you're already arrested. So they can't ask for that until you're already been placed under arrest and charged and taken to the station. Mhm. So, at that point, you're you're cooked already. And and the one at the station, can you refuse the one at the station as well?

So, you can refuse all of the tests. Now, there are consequences to your driver's license if you refuse the breathalyzer test or a blood test. So, after after you've been arrested, after you're in handcuffs in the back of the car or whatever, you're clearly under arrest. That is the only time legally the officer can ask for a breath test or a blood test. and he reads to you from a green little card. It's called the Georgia implied consent notice. And Georgia law requires you to submit to a test of your breath, blood, urine, blah blah blah.

And then do you agree to submit to a test of your breath, which is the most common? And if you don't, your license may be suspended for one year. That's a hard suspension. That implied consent comes in when people are applying for a driver's license. Is that when the consent is implied like when you agree to that? Yes. Exactly. So the you we we we it's not a right to drive. We have a it's a privilege to drive. It's a privilege to have a driver's license. And part of your agreement with DDS Department driver services when you're getting your license says, "Hey, all right.

I get my license." And you tell them if I'm ever investigated for a DUI and the officer reads this, I'm going to give them a test, right? And if I don't, my license just expired my birthday. You have the I have to go to the DMV. You got to go to DMV. You have the right to travel freely. You do not have the right to have a stateisssued driver's license. Correct. Correct. So, let me say one thing, right? First of all, I can't tell you how much I appreciate cops. There's bad apples everywhere. Absolutely. Yeah.

Right. Me, too. Like, I love cop. We live in in Cobb County. Yep. Right. Yeah. Cobb County police. If something even small happens, I cannot tell you like a whole swat sticker in 10 seconds to protect you, right? And so I've loved cops. I owed I know there's bad apples cuz I mentioned the Ryan. They're doing their job, right? You know, for the most part, um, a lot like defense attorneys. Like defense attorneys on my or PI attorneys. Yeah. Um, I always talk about the defense attorneys on the PI on the PI side. Like they're not bad people, but they're just doing their job, right?

So, I follow this lawyer thing on social and I saw this and I was like, is this actually possible? So, this guy um, this older man gets pulled over at a a DUI checkpoint or right and the cops come up to him. He barely cracks his window like this much. And this is when you were saying you don't have to get out of the car. Um they're like and he puts his license right there on the window. And he's he goes, "My attorney told me not to answer any questions." They're like, "Have you been drinking?" My attorney told me not to answer any questions.

What do you need? Your driver's license is right here. Can you roll your window down? You can see it right here. Yeah. Right. like and they and he they kept asking him questions and he was just like here's this here's he barely cracked his window I can still hear you I can't hear you can you roll out your window can you get out of the like and they let him go like and just like he literally did I was like can you actually do that you can I mean legally so a lot of times though keep in mind you might get an obstruction charge on top of it but I would argue that's not obstruction I won't get into any trouble I know I know I'm I'm in general, but like you know, yeah, I mean, depending on the cops, they're 99% of cops are amazing human beings.

We I work I'm the public defender in Alpharetta and Milton Municipal Court and we have and I mean cop county, we have some of the best law enforcement in the state of Georgia. Like we really do. We're very very lucky and they do an amazing job and they do their jobs and they do they do great work. At the end of the day as a defense attorney, my job is to make sure that my that the state has proved their case beyond a reasonable doubt, right? And met every element. My job is not to get my clients off.

It's not it's not I'm not my job is not to get you off or get you get the case dismissed against your that you're found innocent. That is not my job. And I make that very clear with my clients. Like my job is to really truly investigate the evidence and make sure that they can prove every element of the crime and prove their case beyond the reasonable doubt and that your constitutional rights are protected. And most of the time we are able to mitigate and find a resolution that is what is best for my client.

I never ever sell myself as like, "Nope, we're going to get this dismissed. We're going to I have no idea what's going to happen on your case the first time I meet you. I have no idea or what you're going through in life or what you're going through in life or what's happening and what you need. What is the best resolution for you? Because an example this week I had a client who had a DUI and it was a very weak DUI case and the prosecutor agreed but you know she agreed to reduce it to reckless driving which is a win or we would have to send it up to the state court.

And my client was like, "Well, I just I feel like we can win this." And I'm like, "We can. We probably can, but at what cost to you?" Mhm. Or you can take this plea and know what's exactly going to happen and this is going to be done and over with. It'll be off your record rather than sending it up to the state court and having to drag it out again. A, you're going to have to pay me more money and b it's like more time and like this is weighing very heavily on you. Like this is something that you wake up and think about every day.

Yeah. It's a decision they have to make. It's a decision he has to make, right? But like at what cost? So part of my job is to help my clients understand like no, this isn't a complete dismissal maybe and it's not a not guilty completely, but ultimately for your mental health and for your sanity and what's best for your life in one year from now, this truly might be the best decision at this time. Because if we were to send it up to state court, it would have dragged on for another year, right? And then he would have had to and it would have started from scratch and after kind of like explaining it and really helping him through because to me I it makes no difference in my world per se.

You know, it's it's I'm going to fight it. I'm going to support my client whatever they want to do. It's their case. I would have made more money, but that's not what I that's not why I do what I do. And so he rightfully I said, "If you were my brother, I would tell you as my brother, this is what you need to do now and this is what I recommend you do." And so that was the right resolution. There were times when I was doing criminal defense, I had again being Persian members of my family. Yeah. That their a knee-jerk reaction is like, "You you represent criminals." Yeah.

I was like, "No, you you actually criminal defense attorneys, they represent the United States Constitution." Yeah. Essentially. Yeah. because you're you have the client, but you're just making sure that all of their rights are are protected and and what I do specifically, and I don't take on a lot of cases. I keep my practice very like boutique because I want to be able to provide that customized defense. Every client's different. Every single client's different. They can have the most similar case facts, the same exact officer, the like the most similar case facts, but the people are completely different.

And you cannot forget that because what is best for one client may not be what's best for the other and vice versa. So, you really got to make sure and dictate the resolutions and cases and not only just the resolution, but how the case is handled. I have clients that I literally need to like handhold through everything and that's okay. Yeah, cuz I can usually tell after the first meeting, but then I have clients who are like, "Oh, I don't want to hear anything from you. You just tell me where to send the money." Like, they just don't care.

I mean, I tell my kids like, "Everyone's human. Everyone makes mistakes. Everyone has issues. Everyone's family law taught me everyone's crazy, right? Different levels of cra of crazy." And I'm like, if we can just prevent 80%. I know you're Yeah. I know things will happen. Yeah. Right. In your control. You might be going through something, right? And you might make make a mistake, but no. Kind of like what can we do to prevent the mistakes? Get an Uber or don't think you can drive or like, you know, don't talk.

Don't talk. Yeah. Their officer is telling you they're they're cool. They're they understand California. Don't give it to them. Yeah. And I made that mistake. Like I'm not again I just play lawyer on TV. 99% of people do because they it's natural and it's natural. You're right. But I'm like if we could just prevent know your rights, right? You know, and I'm not saying know how to trick the system. I'm saying just know what your rights are. Try to avoid the situation to begin with. You know, if you're going to be in that situation, how can we handle it best?

You know, you just said we're not trying to trick the system. I think that I'm really happy you said that because a lot of people think that way. They're like, "Oh, well, you're helping." No, no, no, no. We're not helping criminals get away with anything. Our constitutionally protected rights that you're afforded. If anything, but people don't know. I don't know. Like, I get Oh, you're California. Oh, cool. You smoke, too? Hey, like, yeah, hang out. One of the most interesting thing that we've been having a lot of over every year politically, it gets worse.

The disc public discourse gets worse. we hate each other more. What the country gets a lot of flack and although we have a lot of room for improvement, I urge people to spend one day in criminal court with with public defense attorneys. Yeah. Not not privately retained counsel as yourself where people have means. Those of us that don't have means to a defense, this country still provides defense and that is not common across the globe. It's one of those things that I really feel like sets us apart. I'm getting goosebumps like I feel patriotic.

I really do. No, it is. It's very true. I mean, we have and we're really lucky. Like, so like Fulton County has a builtin public um defenders office and they are some of the best criminal defense attorneys. I mean, when I get a client who calls me, like a mom called me on behalf of her son and she's like, "Well, he's got the public defender." And I'm like, "Well, which county?" She says, "Folk." I'm saying, "Ma'am, listen. If you guys are truly indigent, like that's going to be your best resource. They are the some of the strongest and best defense attorneys in this state.

The public defend Oh, indigent. Indigent is um people who uh don't have the funds, who would qualify, who are, you know, can't afford to hire a private attorney. Got it." And um Thank you. And they are, you know, they really are. They're some of the best attorneys in the state. We have other counties nearby like Cobb County and um Forsythe County. Um they have an appointed list in Gwynet County as well. So they don't have like a built-in public defender's office, but they have private defense attorneys who are on this list that people can apply and qualify for if they cannot afford to hire private counsel.

So you're getting a private defense attorney who's going to be able to help you through the process and work through the system. Um, so you know, we are as citizens of this great state and country, we are afforded those rights that you're, like you said, are not common anywhere else in the world. They're just not. I'm sorry about that weird clip. I'm dressed in something completely different. But I did need to jump in and let you know that that is the first part of a two-part series because I had such an amazing time speaking with Alvaro and Manel that we completely lost track of time and it went over almost 3 hours.

So what we've done is we've edited and condensed it into two separate parts. This was part one. I hope you got a lot out of it. This was about what to do mostly with law enforcement, how to handle traffic stops, uh some consumeroriented information coming from some attorneys that hopefully you guys can use. Part two, if you tune in for next week, we get into well, we get a little bit personal. We talk about some mental health issues, uh, some of the exercises we've gone through, and just how everyone, regardless of age or occupation, what it is that we go through, some of the battles that everyone faces, and and how best to handle that and support each other.

As always, I'm doing this to help support all of you. You could support me by sharing this podcast and tuning in. And also, if you've got any advice, if there's anything that you'd like to hear about, if there's a topic I can discuss that would be of importance to you, or if you'd like to be a guest, if you think that you've got some wisdom or advice or information that you want to share with the world, we've got a platform ready for you. We'd love to have you on. Thank you for listening to today's episode.

And for part two, make sure to tune in next week. Take care.